Home Inspection and Real Estate Forum for Home Inspectors and Real Estate Professionals
  [Search] Search   [Recent Topics] Recent Topics   [Hottest Topics] Hottest Topics  
[Register] Register / 
[Login] Login 
[Logo]












What is a Home Inspection?
What is the real danger?  XML
Forum Index » Electrical
Author Message
Juan Jimenez
Seal Team 6
[Avatar]

Joined: 06/18/2014 08:53 PM EDT
Messages: 988
Location: Richmond, VA
Offline

Hey guys

I wrote up a panel with breakers in a clothes closet the other day. Home was built in 1992.

Listing agent is having a fit.

I get that we don't want ocpd within the vicinity if easily ignitable materials, but with the breakers inside a metal enclosure, what's the real danger here? Have any fires actually started from a breaker tripping in a clothes closet. I would think it's more likely that a tripped breaker would start a fire in a garage, but no problems with installing them there.

http://www.ahouseonarock.com
http://www.chimneysweeprichmond.com
[WWW]
Troy Pappas
49er
[Avatar]

Joined: 06/18/2014 09:02 PM EDT
Messages: 330
Location: Virginia Beach
Offline

Clearance requirements most likely will not be met in closet.

Hampton Roads Home Inspections

www.SafeHousePropertyInspections.com

www.virginiahomeinspector.us



Call 757-418-0944 to schedule now!
[Email] [WWW]
Nathan
King
[Avatar]

Joined: 06/17/2014 09:32 PM EDT
Messages: 5236
Location: Carmel, IN
Offline

To Juan's point, they exist, they don't cause issues. Heck, we see pictures constantly of panels in precarious places...and I've never heard of the first issue from this. Breakers offer excellent protection.

We still got to call them.

P. Nathan Thornberry
www.Nathan.tv
Take Your Career to the Next Level > https://youtu.be/hdBCJbl5byo
The #1 Vendor in Real Estate & Home Inspection
www.InspectionSuccess.net
www.RWSwarranty.com
www.InspectorServicesGroup.com
www.RecallChek.com
www.InspectorLab.com
www.InspectionSuperConference.com

Find a Certified Inspection Expert exclusively at www.InspectionCentral.net
Get your E&O Insurance at 20%+ off your current rates at www.RWSinsurance.com
[Email] [WWW]
Joe Tedesco
Wizard
[Avatar]

Joined: 06/19/2014 08:59 AM EDT
Messages: 151
Location: Boston, Massachusetts
Offline

Juan Jimenez wrote:Hey guys

I wrote up a panel with breakers in a clothes closet the other day. Home was built in 1992.

Listing agent is having a fit.

I get that we don't want ocpd within the vicinity if easily ignitable materials, but with the breakers inside a metal enclosure, what's the real danger here? Have any fires actually started from a breaker tripping in a clothes closet. I would think it's more likely that a tripped breaker would start a fire in a garage, but no problems with installing them there.


Section 240-24(d) was revised in the 1981 NEC to add the words "such as in clothes closets" because it was felt that the practice of panelboards with overcurrent protective devices installed in clothes closets created a hazard, even more than a fixture not properly installed per Code. In dwelling type occupancies clothes closets are filled with clothes covering panels, and they are also located behind closed doors. With the use of many panelboards with overcurrent protective devices being installed in the apartment closets, the tenants are unable to reset their GFCI for bathrooms if a GFCI breaker is used quickly. Also, locating overcurrent protective devices in clothes closets violates the required working clearances found in Sections 110-16, 422, and 440-14 because they are not "readily accessible".

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 06/27/2014 05:37 PM EDT


Joe Tedesco, NEC Consultant

My statements, written or oral on this site, shall not be considered as the official position of NFPA or any of its Committees, and shall not be considered to be, nor be relied upon as, a Formal Interpretation. They are my personal opinions.
[WWW]
Nathan
King
[Avatar]

Joined: 06/17/2014 09:32 PM EDT
Messages: 5236
Location: Carmel, IN
Offline

I can't think of a more complete and accurate way to answer that one!

Now for the big question- when was the house built Juan?

P. Nathan Thornberry
www.Nathan.tv
Take Your Career to the Next Level > https://youtu.be/hdBCJbl5byo
The #1 Vendor in Real Estate & Home Inspection
www.InspectionSuccess.net
www.RWSwarranty.com
www.InspectorServicesGroup.com
www.RecallChek.com
www.InspectorLab.com
www.InspectionSuperConference.com

Find a Certified Inspection Expert exclusively at www.InspectionCentral.net
Get your E&O Insurance at 20%+ off your current rates at www.RWSinsurance.com
[Email] [WWW]
Eric V
Borat
[Avatar]

Joined: 06/19/2014 12:31 PM EDT
Messages: 9
Location: The Treasure Coast
Offline

Nathan, the house was built in 1992.

The NEC is a safety code and anything perceived as hazardous is a violation of that code. How many times have we seen double-lugging and nothing has happened for 30 years or more? I can't say I have ever heard of a fire starting in a closet, but that doesn't mean it hasn't happened. It is still wrong.

Looks like Dallas isn't the place to be :http://www.dallasnews.com/news/community-news/plano/headlines/20100820-Experts-say-electrical-panels-in-Dallas-8568.ece as somehow,
Many found in closets
The suspect Stab-Lok circuit breakers were manufactured beginning in 1960 and used through the 1980s by Federal Pacific Electric. Most - but not all - were installed in closets.


And quite a discussion here: http://www4.iccsafe.org/cgi-bin/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic;f=11;t=000888;p=1

Eric Van De Ven
http://www.magnuminspections.com
(772) 214-9929
[WWW]
Nathan
King
[Avatar]

Joined: 06/17/2014 09:32 PM EDT
Messages: 5236
Location: Carmel, IN
Offline

I missed the 1992. Read too fast... If it were a 1980 house, I wouldn't call it.

P. Nathan Thornberry
www.Nathan.tv
Take Your Career to the Next Level > https://youtu.be/hdBCJbl5byo
The #1 Vendor in Real Estate & Home Inspection
www.InspectionSuccess.net
www.RWSwarranty.com
www.InspectorServicesGroup.com
www.RecallChek.com
www.InspectorLab.com
www.InspectionSuperConference.com

Find a Certified Inspection Expert exclusively at www.InspectionCentral.net
Get your E&O Insurance at 20%+ off your current rates at www.RWSinsurance.com
[Email] [WWW]
 
Forum Index » Electrical
Go to:   
© 2014 Inspector Services Group